Religion in School
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20 posts in this topic

Should religion be allowed in school?

 

If so, to what extent?

 

Should it influence the way classes are taught?

 

Should certain religions/religious teachings be banned from school?

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Religion should be allowed in school as optional classes however I don't feel that it should be enforced or influence classes as that is unfair to anyone not following that religion. And as someone who had to go to Catholic schools I can say being forced to follow a religion just makes you resent it for having your choice taken away from you.

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I think that people should be allowed to follow their religion in school, the extent being to that it isn't to the detriment of other students.

 

Religion should not influence the way classes are taught at all; however, I believe that schools should teach all popular theories on science, instead of only the atheist theories. They are all theories so why not explain the major theories in science?

 

I do not believe that any religious teachings should be banned from school, in fact I believe that schools should allow classes that teach about the different religions and what all goes into each of them. 

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I do agree with Fraejix about his points. I went to a Christian school and they did offer Bible classes, I never took any but it was a wonderful school that handled any problems very quickly.

 

Sometimes, religious organizations handle problems a lot better than secular ones, as I mentioned above. I work for a Christian company and they've handled any problems very well and in a quick way, plus they've been very patient with me. 

 

So yes, people should be allowed to practice their religion, as long as it's not intruding on other students.

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I think there should be a choice between ethics lessons and religion lessons but you have to pick at least one of it.

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simple answer, yes and no.  I went to a catholic shchool,  my parents knew what they were sending me to and paying for.  in a situation like that then yes religion should be allowed.  children are children and their upbringing should be dictated by the parents not society.  on the other hand in a public school classes should be offered as electives and allowed to be taken by students with parental consent. should it be forced apon a child by society  definitely not,  Religious and political viewpoints should be instilled by the parents and then either strengthened or changed as the child grows up and develops their individual personality and beliefs .    As for removing religion from school as in "open prayer groups organized  by students" or the wearing of religious symbols "by individuals" no, if some are offended by students gathering before the school day and offering prayers for the day to what ever religion they practice they should remember  we live in america and that is a freedom granted us by our forefathers.   If the group is interrupting classes,  physically stopping people and forcing them to pray, or stopping others from enacting their given rights then that group should be stopped but people complaining "oh my god he is on school ground openly praying he is hurting my feelings" sorry.   oh and for some background on me.  i was raised roman catholic and as i grew and became more open to ideas and able to form my own opinions i left the religion and took my own path and have been a practicing wiccan for over 20 years... yet i still believe in freedom of religion including that freedom to practice it no matter what religion that may be as long as it does not infringe apon the freedoms of anyone else.

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I think that is a great option @TheLindeN. Essentially a choice between learning about a religion and the morals within it, or a general morals class where it isn't religion based. I like that because the general class could also teach you how to form your own morals and follow them.

 

@Malicent I agree with you that no one should be forced to follow a certain religion. Currently children are forced to take biology classes which are based entirely upon Evolution and Darwinism. 

 

I think saying: "You have a choice between these classes" is a good idea.

 

Or even a generic religions course that teaches you what the different religions are, how they started, and what they believe in.

 

Nothing that forces someone to follow a religion, but shows them the options they have so they can make an informed decision.

 

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34 minutes ago, Fraejix said:

Currently children are forced to take biology classes which are based entirely upon Evolution and Darwinism. 

 

 

Wait a second. Some religions like Christianity (not whole christianity because they are splitted for like 800 years so i will mention here Catholic Church - the most powerful one) accept biology, evolution, darwinism overall as you probably know when church wasn't so corrupted and had stuff to do they were the only scientists and really good teachers with a lot of knowledge

 

Religious man doesn't mean retarded man that fight against science.

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@Fraejix biology is a science that is proven,  now within that science are a lot of theorys as to how  certain things happen but not based on evolution and Darwinism.   we can see what a cell is made of and how it works, we can even see how the most basic building blocks of life come together to make life work and we are even at a stage where we can change those building blocks down to the dna structures.   This is not darwinism nor evolution that is science.    We as a society have forgone darwinism 100% the theory of survival of the fittist has been neutered by mankind.  religion is a belief based solely on theory and  the theory of evolution has a lot of holes in it as does religion but the structure  of a cell does not.   Now we cant see what makes the dna do what it does under a microscope,  is it gods hand or evolution there in lies the theorys, proven facts based off of a theory only strengthen the theory and that is how they eventually become laws example the law of gravity, at one time it was a theory, enough prove facts established it as a law.

 

 Now i think you may have meant Evolution  being taught in class not biology in that i do agree,   if you teach evolution in a biology class then the same class should also teach creationism because both are theory and neither have been proven enough to become laws.  currently the only thing in a school that is 100% proven is math.  History is written by the victors there for 1 history book vs another will have small modifications and omissions based on the view point of the historian, sociology is viewpoints, even english is subject to the bias of the teacher be it grammar or literature.   as for religion in general, if you go to a catholic school yep you should have to learn the ideals and teachings of the religion,  if you go to a Jewish private school you learn their belief system.   public school, religion in my opinion should not be on the curriculum unless it is an elective.  but prayer left to the individual or group of individuals should never be frowned apon no discouraged as long as it does not impede on someone elses ability to learn or go about their daily buisness, again if prayer offends don't take part in it but we shouldn's discourage others from expressing their free will either.

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oh yeah. and i LOVE these types of discussions... 8) thanks for the topic @wilson1012

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5 minutes ago, Malicent said:

@Fraejix biology is a science that is proven,  now within that science are a lot of theorys as to how  certain things happen but not based on evolution and Darwinism.   we can see what a cell is made of and how it works, we can even see how the most basic building blocks of life come together to make life work and we are even at a stage where we can change those building blocks down to the dna structures.   This is not darwinism nor evolution that is science.    We as a society have forgone darwinism 100% the theory of survival of the fittist has been neutered by mankind.  religion is a belief based solely on theory and  the theory of evolution has a lot of holes in it as does religion but the structure  of a cell does not.   Now we cant see what makes the dna do what it does under a microscope,  is it gods hand or evolution there in lies the theorys, proven facts based off of a theory only strengthen the theory and that is how they eventually become laws example the law of gravity, at one time it was a theory, enough prove facts established it as a law.

 

 Now i think you may have meant Evolution  being taught in class not biology in that i do agree,   if you teach evolution in a biology class then the same class should also teach creationism because both are theory and neither have been proven enough to become laws.  currently the only thing in a school that is 100% proven is math.  History is written by the victors there for 1 history book vs another will have small modifications and omissions based on the view point of the historian, sociology is viewpoints, even english is subject to the bias of the teacher be it grammar or literature.   as for religion in general, if you go to a catholic school yep you should have to learn the ideals and teachings of the religion,  if you go to a Jewish private school you learn their belief system.   public school, religion in my opinion should not be on the curriculum unless it is an elective.  but prayer left to the individual or group of individuals should never be frowned apon no discouraged as long as it does not impede on someone elses ability to learn or go about their daily buisness, again if prayer offends don't take part in it but we shouldn's discourage others from expressing their free will either.

Let me rephrase that...

 

In a biology class, they teach evolution as a part of the class.

 

They also specifically talk about Darwinism in the class and what it is.

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25 minutes ago, Malicent said:

 ...proven facts based off of a theory only strengthen the theory and that is how they eventually become laws example the law of gravity, at one time it was a theory, enough prove facts established it as a law.

 

 

I mean to be pedantic a scientific law is still a theory, it's just a theory with no solid opposition and is accepted to be true by the vast majority of leading academics. Gravity is still a theory, but also a law because no one can prove otherwise. All laws are theories, not all theories are laws.

 

Edit: Survival of the fittest is still very much a thing,  it's just within human society the definition of what counts as fit to survive and what does not has drastically altered from it's original.

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@Fraejix yep and to include 1 and then completely denounce the other as a fairy tale is wrong.   

 

@Nebulon  exactly,   and i will stand by my statement of survival of the fittest being neutered.   it does exist, and i like how you put it "drastically altered from its original".  modern human fights this with all of its might, and even pushes the fight into nature drastically changing the survival and propagation of species in the natural world.   GOD WE SUCK AS A SPECIES.... lol

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The way it is:

Religion is already taught in schools, its usually referred to as mythology. The two main modern religions are treated as no go zones (Christianity, and Islam).

The way it should be:
A second alternative history class for those who have passed all of the previous ones called "religious history". It teaches you what each religion believes in, you study the books of each of the major world religions, and you talk about previous religions. It goes over what caused them to end, and how new ones were started.

Science classes should teach us the modern day theories and why the evidence behind them is overwhelming, evolution, climate change, etc. It should show us practically why they exist, what the models are there to predict, and why they are important without the interference of a religious opinion.

Every one of us is an atheist to the 5000+ other religions of the world except for the one we may believe in. That makes all of us about equal except for one specific one, or none.
Therefore, treat each others belief with respect, I believe Nissan is a good car company, but I don't go recruiting people to like Nissan, I simply drive one. Other people may prefer Ford or Chevy, but again, it's an opinion.

To say that your religion is the only one that will get you to the after life is ridiculous because every religion is based on faith. You cannot provide a reason or logic as to why any religion makes us go to a specific place in the afterlife, so no one should be mad when someone else says that they don't believe them.

This is a very expansive topic, I've made several points and I mean no harm to anyone who may be offended by them. They are my beliefs after all.

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18 hours ago, He_162 said:

The way it should be:
A second alternative history class for those who have passed all of the previous ones called "religious history". It teaches you what each religion believes in, you study the books of each of the major world religions, and you talk about previous religions. It goes over what caused them to end, and how new ones were started.

18 hours ago, He_162 said:

Every one of us is an atheist to the 5000+ other religions of the world except for the one we may believe in. That makes all of us about equal except for one specific one, or none.
Therefore, treat each others belief with respect, I believe Nissan is a good car company, but I don't go recruiting people to like Nissan, I simply drive one. Other people may prefer Ford or Chevy, but again, it's an opinion.
 

 

1. In my country we have philosophy lessons (it starts in high school because before that kids are too young to understand stuff and even to be interested in it.

On philosophy lessons we learn about different religions and all their believes, culture etc. for example in Greek mythology (It's at the beginning because it's well known and easy) we can know the stories from their time period but we don't exactly understand them if we don't know the ancient culture. For example something really simple:

Killing in medival age wasn't a bad thing, there was a way it was honorable and all rich people (nobel people) were training sword fight etc. since they can walk so on the battlefield they were the best fighters and could kill/injure few soldiers before they were injured (Soldiers didn't kill knights and other nobel people because soldier that would catch nobel person would get some money from ransom (small % of it because the rest of it is for army leader/general).

 

So how do we see killing and ransom, "kidnapping from the battlefield" today?

killing is bad, kidnapping is horrible, and ransom is not cool but today it's prisoner for prisoner thing (Guantanamo bay as an example as trade post for prisoners).

Fuck we even discuss if killing injured near dead person is a murder or not.

I would write more but i already made my point and i don't want you to fall asleep.

 

2. "Every one of us is an atheist to the 5000+ other religions" No. You don't understand what atheism means. ateism means anti-theism so God or supernatural stuff don't exist also atheism assumes religion is against intellect etc.

 

So for example Islam - There is one God and people that don't believe in this God are damned and if you are sinner but you will convince somebody to your God (Allah) you will go to heaven, the only exception is Atheism, atheists in Islam are like subhumans for Germans ohh wait political correctness: like for Nazis from the Moon are Jews and Eastern people... and everybody else. ;P 

Why Atheism is hated in Islam? I have no idea what's interesting they copied that idea from Christians (Like half of religion lol) My guess is christianity is better known to you than Islam because you live in Western world so let's show an example of something that is already known or at least acceptable by society:

Evolution!

Part of christian society (don't know which one exactly) don't accept evolution and some accept so let's talk about the one that accept:

Some people believe that Bible is a metaphor let's say it is (personally i think picking what you like in religion is stupid to me) so now you have a problem is "know" the same as "believe"? If you know something is it still faith?

 

For example let's say angels are fucking real and you saw one and now you know that angels are real but do you believe in them? In Christianity and Islam if you don't believe in God and everything in Holy Books you will go to hell right? So if you know about angels but you don't believe in them then it's kinda akward.

 

And again i wrote too much, i made my point and then i wrote more and more and now i have no idea what i'm talking about anymore.

 

PS: If i'm wrong about Islam and there is any muslim that can correct me about atheism etc. please do it.

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11 hours ago, TheLindeN said:

1. In my country we have philosophy lessons (it starts in high school because before that kids are too young to understand stuff and even to be interested in it.

On philosophy lessons we learn about different religions and all their believes, culture etc. for example in Greek mythology (It's at the beginning because it's well known and easy) we can know the stories from their time period but we don't exactly understand them if we don't know the ancient culture. For example something really simple:

Killing in medival age wasn't a bad thing, there was a way it was honorable and all rich people (nobel people) were training sword fight etc. since they can walk so on the battlefield they were the best fighters and could kill/injure few soldiers before they were injured (Soldiers didn't kill knights and other nobel people because soldier that would catch nobel person would get some money from ransom (small % of it because the rest of it is for army leader/general).

 

So how do we see killing and ransom, "kidnapping from the battlefield" today?

killing is bad, kidnapping is horrible, and ransom is not cool but today it's prisoner for prisoner thing (Guantanamo bay as an example as trade post for prisoners).

Fuck we even discuss if killing injured near dead person is a murder or not.

I would write more but i already made my point and i don't want you to fall asleep.

 

2. "Every one of us is an atheist to the 5000+ other religions" No. You don't understand what atheism means. ateism means anti-theism so God or supernatural stuff don't exist also atheism assumes religion is against intellect etc.

 

So for example Islam - There is one God and people that don't believe in this God are damned and if you are sinner but you will convince somebody to your God (Allah) you will go to heaven, the only exception is Atheism, atheists in Islam are like subhumans for Germans ohh wait political correctness: like for Nazis from the Moon are Jews and Eastern people... and everybody else. ;P 

Why Atheism is hated in Islam? I have no idea what's interesting they copied that idea from Christians (Like half of religion lol) My guess is christianity is better known to you than Islam because you live in Western world so let's show an example of something that is already known or at least acceptable by society:

Evolution!

Part of christian society (don't know which one exactly) don't accept evolution and some accept so let's talk about the one that accept:

Some people believe that Bible is a metaphor let's say it is (personally i think picking what you like in religion is stupid to me) so now you have a problem is "know" the same as "believe"? If you know something is it still faith?

 

For example let's say angels are fucking real and you saw one and now you know that angels are real but do you believe in them? In Christianity and Islam if you don't believe in God and everything in Holy Books you will go to hell right? So if you know about angels but you don't believe in them then it's kinda akward.

 

And again i wrote too much, i made my point and then i wrote more and more and now i have no idea what i'm talking about anymore.

 

PS: If i'm wrong about Islam and there is any muslim that can correct me about atheism etc. please do it.

1. Culture changes, and religion adapts.

2. Atheist does not mean what I used it for, all words change over time, and atheism is often confused with agnosticism. I've been debating this topic for years and have yet to find a reason to care about the semantics behind it because you know what I meant in the first place, and completely avoided the original topic.

Do you see where I am going with this?
-edit- I reread what I said and it sounds very blunt and somewhat rude, don't take it that way please. Religion is a hard topic to have a pleasant debate about, so just keep in mind I'm not trying to anger anyone with my opinion here.

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blunt and rude? i would ask where and why because to me it's nonsense to think that and nothing will change my opinion about what is rude and what's not so i won't even ask.

 

I'm wonder how somebody would confuse agnosticism with atheism. (I'm Agnostic)

 

Also i would disagree with "Culture changes, and religion adapts." because religion makes culture and people adapt to it.

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Just one minor detail. Islam isn't based of Christianity, nor is it the other way around. Instead they share a common basis in Judaism.

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6 hours ago, Nebulon said:

Just one minor detail. Islam isn't based of Christianity, nor is it the other way around. Instead they share a common basis in Judaism.

Didn't know that, thanks for sharing it.

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Just now, TheLindeN said:

Didn't know that, thanks for sharing it.

The more the world knows the better off it is ;) 

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